Queer Coding Disney’s Male Animated Villains || Chilling Challenge Day 2

Queer Coding Disney’s Male Animated Villains || Chilling Challenge Day 2

Hello everyone! Thank you to the Princess
for kicking us off yesterday with some super cool facts about her favorite female villain,
Maleficent, and so it only makes sense that today’s topic is favorite male villain. But the thing is,
I don’t really have one. I don’t hate them or anything, but
no one really stands out in my mind. But when I was doing the planning
for this video, I was looking pretty closely at the male villains, and I
started to notice a few things. Isn’t it weird how often male villains are
creepy? That’s not unexpected, I mean they are villains after all, but the female
villains aren’t usually like this. Though not without their own sexist problems,
female villains are usually cold and powerful, regal and impressive. But male villains, how often
are they flirtatious or predatory? Manipulative, physically
weak, or easily frightened? How often are they
sassy, thin, or well-dressed? These aren’t a smattering of random characteristics,
these kinds of traits are grouped together pretty frequently in the form of what’s
known as the “sissy archetype.” A “sissy” is defined as someone who is effeminate or
cowardly, usually used to insult men by saying they have feminine qualities. And the part
of the sissy in film dates back to the silent film era. But I want you to think about these
characteristics a little more for a second. What do they remind you
of besides villains? Perhaps… …the sassy gay friend? You know! The thin, weak, limp-wristed guy who loves clothes
so much that he dresses better than most women? TV Tropes refers to this as the “Camp Gay” trope,
and says that this character was most likely inspired by the flamboyant Oscar Wilde. Now there’s nothing wrong with being an
effeminate, fashion-loving gay man. But when it’s the predominant representation
of the queer community, it leads to negative and restrictive stereotypes of
an extremely diverse community. And to take it one step further, the problem
is even worse when this kind of character only appears in children’s media as the villain. Now, characters that fit the Camp Gay trope,
like Damien from “Mean Girls,” or like, 90% of the characters in “The Birdcage,”
are usually forthcoming about being gay. Disney villains are not. How are the two connected? And how can villains like Frollo and Jafar
fall into these effeminate sissy villain categories when they have obvious
heterosexual tendencies? Because queer coding, that’s why! This is now the third time I’ve
mentioned this in a video, and feministdisney gives an awesome
explanation of what it is: “A character that is given certain characteristics
that are likely to reference ‘queerness’ in the audience’s subconscious. Queer coding
doesn’t necessarily mean a character is gay—or that their evilness is based in
being queer—it means that the character is evil because society
associates queer with bad.” There’s this really fantastic paper called
Gender Transgression and Villainy in Animated Film that talks about how villains show characteristics
of gender deviance, basically what society does not expect of its members. The paper also notes that with these kinds
of villains, “by the end of the movie…are always brought under
control and destroyed to restore the natural social order, removing any possibility for these characters to
truly subvert heterogender norms.” But how does Disney queer code their villains? The things I’m going to be discussing might
seem vague or non-existent when looked at by themselves, but when juxtaposed with their
heroic counterparts, it’s much easier to see. And it’s important to remember that heroes
represent appropriate gender presentation as well as desirable and encouraged
traits in general. And by that same token, villains reflect undesirable
and wrong behaviors. This video is not an invitation for you to
find every single exception to the rule. There are even going to be some
villains that I talk about here that don’t fit every single
marker for queer coding. The point of this is to show that these
patterns exist and are not anomalies. Since gender presentation is usually grounded
in the physical, let’s really look at the villains. Starting with body type, heroes are solid
and muscular and handsome. The epitome of masculinity and what young boys should aspire
to be and look like. They have prominent jawlines and obvious muscles and square faces.
And of course, Disney heroes almost always end up with a Disney heroine. And male villains can be these things. Like Gaston, or Rourke, or Clayton, or Hans. But more often, they’re not. In fact, they’re usually
very unlike the typical hero. They’re usually thin, and ugly and have long narrow faces, they lack any defined muscle, they have
skinny arms or legs, if we can even see them. They look positively wimpy next to their hero. Look at this side profile of Scar and Mufasa. Mufasa’s face is noticeably more
broad and strong than Scar’s face. Scar looks emaciated
next to the beefy and solid Mufasa. And they’re supposed to be brothers;
they should look a little similar. The same goes for Hades and Zeus. Hades has this very long and
thin face, whereas Zeus’s face is pretty much a square. And while it’s
pretty obvious that Zeus and Hercules are ripped, you can’t really tell with Hades
because of his outfit. He’s got on this long flowing robe that conceals any indication of physical strength. [Stuffy voice]
Manly men should be proud
to display their bodies. [Normal voice]
And they usually do. [Sarcastic disgusted voice]
But cowardly and sissy men like Jafar
and Hades and Frollo wear “dresses”. [Normal voice]
And when they don’t wear dresses, it’s not like their fashion is a ton more
traditionally masculine anyway. When we talk about wardrobe, Governor Ratcliffe
from “Pocahontas” is probably the best example. Oh, let’s see, there are
just so many things: his wardrobe is pink, a dark
magenta pink, but a pink nonetheless, which a Disney hero would never be
caught wearing, but would probably make fun of a man for wearing
because it’s a “girly” color. [Wreck-it Ralph movie clip]
Ralph: I see you’re a fan of pink. Should I mention the pigtails tied
with pink ribbons now? There is such an attention to
detail in Ratcliffe’s ensemble: he has frilly cuffs, he’s got
a cape, a proper hat, and this jeweled…belt…cape…thing? What?! But John Smith’s running around the
woods in this simple manly outfit because men don’t care about
their clothing or appearance. They’re men of action, they go
out and do things! And just this. Yes. This entire scene actually,
now that I think about it. Why do male villains usually
have ghost makeup? Like, darkened eyelids, and lips. Male villains also usually have eyelashes. You know who else has eyelashes? The princesses. The villainesses. The female characters. You know who doesn’t
have eyelashes? Literally any other male character. Then there’s body language. They all hold
themselves up proudly, chests out, shoulders back. They do not have a firm gait,
they glide, they’re graceful. To put it in the simplest terms, these male Disney villains, are most likened to female Disney villains. Think about it: the faces, the implied makeup, the posture, the clothing, the body types are all trademarks of the
most famous Disney female villains. So it’s a double whammy! Because it’s
bad for a man to have feminine qualities, and men who have feminine qualities are automatically
assumed to be gay, which kind of just enforces these traditional ideas of gender roles and
that masculine and feminine should be together, or that a person has to be either one of these
things to be considered “normal.” I don’t know is that
more like a quadruple whammy? Male villains are usually given feminine
traits because being a woman is bad, but being a man who acts
like a woman is worse. But they’re not doing this anymore right? We’re past that subtle ingrained
homophobia of the entire history of cinema. Let’s look at a more recent movie. “Wreck-it Ralph,” that’s a good one, good film. We’ve got King Candy. Tiny, wimpy, okay,
but who’s the hero? Wreck-it Ralph. Yeah. Super buff, really huge, you get
my drift, there’s a huge contrast. While Felix is much closer to King Candy’s
physique than Ralph is, and he actually has some feminine qualities, he also has a very
prominent heterosexual romantic story line. Just in case the audience
thought he might be… [whispers] a gay. Though I do give some credit to Disney for
Felix being feminine and shorter and certainly much less physically capable
than his romantic interest. But “Wreck-it Ralph” did run into some issues when he uses a subtle homophobic slur against King Candy. [Frustration at the homophobic undertones
in children’s media]
AAAAAGGHHHH! And that’s honestly not everything. There
are characters I didn’t get to really talk about because I didn’t have time! Like Ratigan
from “The Great Mouse Detective,” or even antagonistic characters like Chi-Fu from “Mulan,” or Ursula
who was based off of a drag queen. This doesn’t mean that you can’t still
love Scar, or Hades, or anybody that I mentioned. They’re cool and interesting villains who
are really fun to watch. You might’ve even realized your sexual or gender identity by
watching these characters when you were younger. And the fact that these characters are problematic,
and reflect this idea that queer is bad, does not make your
realization any less real or valid. But it is something to be aware of, and to
encourage Disney not to continue in the future. [Tune of “If You’re Happy and You Know It”]
If you want more
varied queer roles clap your hands. [Clap, Clap] Thanks for watching. Like this video if you
think Queen Elsa should end up with another woman, or if you’re happy to keep her as asexual
representation because that’s important too. Subscribe to watch more of our Chilling
Challenge. And let me know in the comments if Disney
helped you realize any sexual or gender identity. Or if you just wanted to be a villain. The Princess will see you tomorrow. Zazu: [sighs] There’s one in every family, sire. Two in mine, actually. And they always manage
to ruin special occasions.

100 thoughts on “Queer Coding Disney’s Male Animated Villains || Chilling Challenge Day 2”

  1. 23 years watching Disney films and this is the first time i see the villains relationed to queers and not manly stuff… and i always tought they we're just evil with no relationship to queers and how noy as manly as the protagonist we're…

  2. Another thing to notice that might be interesting is that a number of Famous Male villains were designed and animated by an openly Gay man Andreas Deja. (Horned King, Scar, Jafar, Gaston, )

  3. I think a lot of people commenting on this video are forgetting that these characters did not 'choose' to be a certain way; they were created, drawn and represented in a certain way, and those were choices made by the animators and directors. While it's easy to pick apart individual cases (like, "oh well in this case the inspiration for the character came from x period in history, or y role"), what we are examining is not just one individual case, it's a whole pattern of representation. As shared in the video, when we look at the traits that are consistently used across the board to represent villains (who are, well, the villains, and rarely get any form of redemption or backstory to explain their motivations beyond being evil), and the contrast between how protagonists are represented.

    We see traits that are viewed as being divergent from 'traditional' gender roles being consistently represented in villains, and that often being the ONLY way that these divergent traits are represented (at least in main characters, aside from some tokenism that has emerged in recent years, like the shopkeeper in Frozen who was on screen for like .3 seconds lol).

    If divergent gender traits and representation were being consistently represented in other characters in the main cast, this wouldn't be an issue, because rather than divergent gender representation being only associated with villainy, it would be something that is seen across the board.

    But the point is that the ONLY times these divergent gender traits (and, let's be honest, stereotypes) are used in main cast members is with villains. This leads to the association between people who are coded as being non-'traditional' (non-straight or cis) with being bad. And as was said in the video, these characters are usually defeated at the end, with the characters who subscribe to traditional gender norms prevailing. This leads to the association of "different means, bad, 'normal' beats different). While this might not seem like a super obvious message, it's the fact that this is consistently used across Disney (and other children's films): these are the things that kids watch over and over again, and if this is the only way they are seeing people who are different from 'traditional' gender norms, they are going to pick up on the idea that different is something lesser, and something to be feared.

    It's not just the individual movie or character, it's the pattern, and it's one we need to change. We can have more characters who have some of these traits, who do not subscribe to traditional gender roles and traits, as protagonists, have bad guys who LOOK like what we believe the good guy looks like. Breaking the pattern can change this.

  4. This problem is why I love Pleakley from Lilo and Stitch. He is a character who is feminine and even regular crossdresses (especially in the cartoon series), but this is never seen as a weakness. While he is technically a minor villain in the beginning of Lilo and Stitch, he is a good guy in the end and in sequels.

  5. There's a great video on who the real villian of The Bird Cage was and I agree with the reviewer's conclusion. None of the queens in The Bird Cage was a villian. The real villian in that movie was Val, the college kid who insists that his father suddenly change their whole lifestyle and appearances to impress a conservative Republican senator and his wife. Val's character even speaks softly and under his breath, thus emphasizing the fact that he's attempting something that is very rude sounding to his parents. It's interesting when you name the male Disney villians and how they are often portrayed as gay.

  6. I think that a lot of this also connects to why older audiences (especially women online in fanart/fanfic communities) connect with villains and/or get crushes on them moreso than heroes. I've found it especially prominent with Batman's Rogue Gallery, Thrax from Osmosis Jones, Captain Hook, etc. Humans are flawed, and we don't fit into these neat little hero/heroine molds; we identify with the villains, who deviate from these norms.
    (There's also a whole other barrel of monkeys with female characters displaying male-coded traits, like control or aggression. They're often single (but adoptive or step-)mothers, and thus have to run and maintain the household. It even goes so far as Ursula, who was based on Divine.)

  7. Huh, interesting approach. I always thought Ratcliffe's wardrobe was to represent luxury and snobbery. But this video makes me look at all them a different way. I think the best example was King Candy. That one really pissed me off the first time l watched it!! 😑😑😑

  8. That's one of the things that How To Train Your Dragon does that I like. The main hero is this thin, wimpy kid. And there's a character who likes to soak up information and is always spouting relevant facts, but is also quite big and bulky. I like that.

  9. So gay men are weak manipulative and predatory when I see gay people I don’t think these thinks this actually the first time I’ve heard these characteristics used for them notice only women make these videos cause a gay male probably would not describe them selves this way

  10. It's not pink. it's magenta/purple, which was the most expensive color at that period, showing how much the Pocahontas villain valued money, power and status. A hero wouldn't wear it, just because they don't value those things now do they have the money to afford it

  11. Iridescent Aurora

    “They are supposed to be brothers, they should look a little more similar”

    Cut to my sister and I who barely even appear to be related at all… I look more similar to our two half sisters.

  12. i found a simple solution to this. seeing how it is wrong to invalidate any gender, even ones people on tumblr make (show me proof there are tribes out there that have something like colorgender or stargender) that there is an infinity of genders, and anything you feel, see or do about your self can be.

    the solution is. "queer coded villain gender"

    i see sometimes the qcv characters will also behave in a classically queer manner, that is out of place, strange, disturbing and out of societies "rules". when you have a villain man who will slap the ass of our male hero, and maybe lick his face, it's still offensive to the same gorup of people who will just dress different and act in the over dramatic, maybe at times "girly girl" ways. which brings us to orginal queer. they new queer will say "that is not us, that is not queer" so they are afraid, or maybe it is "this is not us anymore, we will tell you what queer is" or perhaps they are mad "hey I act this way, stop making characters this way evil"

    wait or was "queer" always how it is in lgbtQ today? that even something being weird and out of place was slander aginst people who were gender non conforming and not cishet? rule breakers of social norms who live for daily dramatic "life is a stage, let's just flit around with this persona of mine and pretend I am in a show"

    maybe if we stop predatory, creepy male villians in media, fewer men in real life will be manipulative, creepy predatory people in real life. and if we had more women villans like that. more real women will. I mean for children's shows in the west. mothers who molest their own daughters in Japanese anime don't count.

    and i am sure there are truely neferous gender rebels out there. you just need to know where they are, flush them out, and let them do their thing. the ones who make "LOL open season on the cishets" the "burn the transmedicalists" the "TERFs are terrorists, lesbians who don't have sex with women with dicks, at any level of transition are TERFs"(but no no, never suggest they also mean not getting laid is an act of terrorism)

    the trueist villian is one who does all the rules. because you don't know they are among you, you won't be able to tell. someone who does the thing, and has the personal style of "this will freak people out" are I guess trolling everyone?

    what happens if some people and their religious beliefs fall into the same trope? it's wrong for us to do it in our movies, if some tribe of people is living like their ancestors did 1,000 years ago, and doing worse beliefs. we have to jump in and stop them. either like you do with a child who did a small "no no" or hard justice with a dash of colonalism. learn 'em good.

    and seeing how religions and spirituality, myths can be the "original stories". blame them. aren't some of the most powerful evil doers with the capacity to befuddle us with alluring beauty and grace. https://darrellcreswell.wordpress.com/2013/01/13/the-beauty-of-satan-if-i-were-the-devil-bible-verses-truth/

  13. Wait…. what sassy gay friend you know creepily wanted to hook up with a female you knew, even if that meant raping her? Oh wait, so Jafar, Gaston, and Judge Frolo having these traits aren't gay????!!!

  14. Which crevice in your ass did you pull this shit out of?
    Scar is very 'manly'
    And so is gaston.
    What lies are you spreading?

  15. Having crushes on Disney Princesses as a kid helped me realize I'm bisexual, but also the fact that no Disney Princess ended up with a woman also was one of the first indicators I had as a child that same sex attraction wasn't "normal".

  16. this is definitely still happening even moana had the evil clam who literally sang a glam rock song meant to sound stylistically like many queer rock stars of the 70s soooo

  17. Pink wasn't a girly color until Mamie Eisenhower started wearing it all the time. A catalogue from 1918 even recommended dressing female babies in blue as it had a "much more delicate and dainty tone." So really, John Smith is in the girly colors…

  18. Ratcliffe was dressed that ridiculously because he was very wealthy and had the privilege to be so, and to have things done FOR him rather than act on his own, therefore not needing more robust outfits…comparing his outfit to John Smith, a seasoned explorer and man of action, who was essentially part of the working class that Ratcliffe brought with him. Sure, its silly what he wears, but the wealthy have always adorned themselves just because they could, and that is a very important and informative piece of his character. It expresses their stations in society, as well as personality.

  19. My personal take on the physique of villains being slender relates more to their personality. They get other people to work for them, they have minions and henchmen to carry out their master plans rather than them having to stoop so low. They have a larger than life fallacy and I see their design as a reinforcement of this. When the Hero's are more characteristically masculine and stronger, it seems as though they enjoy interacting and taking matters into their own hands. With the clothing, when it comes to colours like purple and gold that represents wealth and power. They look more alike to kings and monarchs with all ruling powers which in democratic societies we are opposed to. Also I find a lot of your examples don't look into the characters they are or the action they play in the movie as well as the symbolism played into their design. King Candy is supposed to look weak, innocent and small. It is to dispute any thought that viewers might have to thinking he is a villain.

  20. queer coding is not a thing you stupid idiot. that's stereotyping to say because they have these traits they must be gay. and frankly as a gay ma I and sick to death of bitches like you useing me to inforce your brand of facism on the world.

  21. +The Princess and the Scrivener

    I have a friend who works in Disney animation, and he had an interesting opinion on this. He suggests this happens a lot because Disney models a lot of their villains from Iago (or Iago related characters), who as you remember is a very effeminate (some make arguments that he desired Othello for himself). One of the reasons they choose characters like this as a model is they are easier to slip into the world of the stories, and they offset the hero/heroine well. For example, in Mulan. Mulan is our hero/heroine, and she is absolutely a brave character, but she isn't exactly what could be considered "masculine" (I'll touch on this later). This is why a good villain to offset her was Shan Yu (a serious masculine male). And likewise, you get the offset of Hades to Hercules, and Mufasa to Scar, etc. The goal is to have a hero/heroine is as different as can be from the villain, or they worry it will compromise/dilute the character of the hero/heroine OR villain.

    A second example he gave, was in cases where you have effeminate heroes (especially heroines), it can be too disturbing for a children's audience (this is Disney's opinion) for the villain to have a strong masculine character. As rage displacement of masculine male characters can be triggering in itself. Mulan is one of the only Disney films where the main protagonist is a feminine heroine (not as feminine as the other women at the time, but being brave out of necessity isn't the same as being masculine) and goes up against a masculine male villain. The reason they got away with this was for the "historical accuracy" but I have a personal beef about the inaccuracies and power struggle of Mulan, but I digress.

    Let's examine using this model of a masculine male villain in a fairytale. Say in Tangled, instead of an old female villain, we had an old male villain. We could use Triton from the little mermaid as an example because he is an already established old (noneffeminate) male. Instead of "Mother knows best" imagine "Father knows best" sung by an evil Triton. Imagine the scene where Triton loses his temper with Ariel in the cave, but instead displaced on Rapunzel in the scene towards the end. This is the argument Disney makes about creating male villains uneffeminate. Imagine Triton having an outrage versus Hades having a sassy fit with his flames. It straddles the line between triggering abuse and comical (or this is how they see it). And while Disney likes to incorporate elements of the real world, their brand has to also be careful not to make it too "real."

    Now, I'm not condoning Disney's structure of male villains, but I would like to point out another POV as well. In designing male villains in such a manner, they have also had a secondary effect (perhaps unintentional) outside of associating effeminate men with evil. They give the impression that effeminate men are also cunning and charismatic (at least more so than the protagonist). I remember growing up when Hercules came out, all the other girls in my class (and some boys) had a crush on Hades versus Hercules. His sass and charisma were contagious, to the point it had a lot of people wondering, did we even want the hero to win? And the same can be said for characters like Loki, Iago, etc. I don't think this is a side effect the Disney was aiming for, but it's something I have definitely seen, especially in my generation. Audiences are starting to sympathize more with villains in general, because in a way the model for villains has come to be seen as more relatable to actual humans (crass, cynical, broken, ambitious) versus the hero/heroine who is often (albeit brave) innocent, reckless and clueless. So in the end, it actually can actually contribute to painting queer tendencies in a desirable light (As crazy as that sounds) because they can be more relatable. I at least think Disney villains have given more credit to queer characters than an "actual" Disney lgbtq+ character like LeFou from Beauty and the Beast, which imo was just a laughable disgrace (why Disney, why?).

    In conclusion, my point wasn't to defend Disney, just more to establish why this happens so often. But I absolutely think there needs to be a better representation of queer-related characters. Disney still has a long way to go before it get's that right.

  22. It's not like any of the characters in hercules uses trousers, but yes only hades is using a dress. And definitely Frollo uses a dress, it's not like every single judge uses that kind of clothes.

  23. Doombuggies Give Me Back Problems

    plus, going along with your point at 3:49, the majority of the villains you listed are not outright the villain until the end of the story and some are even plot twists, so it makes sense why they don't share the same characteristic as the majority of male villains!
    (i love this video)

  24. Alejandro Gangotena

    This will sound a bit crazy, but there is something to be said about villains having a more androginous personhood to make em more complete.

    Heroes usually getting in touch with their femininity throughout the movie, while the villain was already there. The villain feels comfortable being wider than the hero. He has already accepted his shadow. And shadow doesn´t need to mean "bad" either. Shadow is mystery as well, it´s a necessary part of the whole.

    All in all, insightful vid, left a like and thanks for sharing (subscribed!)

  25. Id like to point out that many of the comments saying these are queer stereotypes, then say how this is a technique where angles, and sharp faces, and certain looks are associated with villainry.

    That's not any better. So, what if it's actually not queer coding. It's still feeds into looking a certain way. It's still holds that long media tradition that pretty people are good. If you look old, have blemishes, have an angular, non soft face, then you're more likely to see your physical traits on a villain than a hero.

  26. Someone mentioned The Emperor's New Groove and it made me think… hey, Kuzco was a pretty effeminate protagonist and Kronk, who worked for the villain, was more masculine, but Disney screwed itself because Kuzco was selfish and an a bit of an asshole and Kronk was actually nice.

  27. Look at the bright side, many of these villains are memorable, even likeable to an extent. And probably they wouldn't be memorable at all without a bit of flamboyancy.

  28. The "Homophobic slur" Ralph uses against King Candy is nelly, even though in some instances it is used as a slur, the definition of it is a silly person. So I believe it wasnt their intent to have it be used as a slur against homosexuals.

  29. mariana martinez jimenez

    Claude Frollo is dressed with a tunic because he is actually a preast and is less frumpy or skinny than Jafar actually he is a bit more curpulet than the rest of the male villans.

  30. Why would someone do this, is what I would say but at the same time there’s lots of people who really like this content, just cause I don’t like it doesn’t mean other people shouldn’t, also cool video my dude

  31. I really don't have a favorite villain or hero but I really loved Scar from the Lion King. I loved his colors. Black and Dark Brown With piercing green eyes. Probably because I was emo when I was a kid LOL. I liked that he was smooth, sleek, and prideful. I loved the Hyenas too. (And Kovu from TLK 2 was HOT.) But I do/did cringe a bit when I looked back at Scar once I found out I was gay and immediately picked up on the queer coding. I've gotten over it now but it did make me roll my eyes a while back. I wonder how scar will be in the new "live action" Lion King.

  32. I never took Hades as a queer stereotype, he's always been more of an antisemitic stereotype to me, and in a sense Ratcliffe as well.

    and there are positive queer coded characters that display courage and loyalty, fight for their loved ones……like Timon and Pumbaa, Zazu, Oaken, Bucky and Pronk, Cogsworth and Lumier, Flower, Genie the list goes on and on, so i'm not sure this theory holds up to considerable scrutiny.

  33. It could also be that heroes are often depicted as jocks who've been blessed by circumstance, while villains who, to you, may appear effeminate are depicted as go-getters who have to depend on their wits and intellect to overcome any physical barriers. they're facing off against the unrequited love of fate, a fate's that rejected them in favor of the jock archetype. We see this in Game of Thrones, in characters like Varys and Little Finger who are may appear effeminate but are in fact the intellectual counterparts to characters such as robert baratheon and neddard stark. I'm not sure that's queer code. I think it's just a play on opposites , exploring power dynamics within and without character relationships to tell a complete story. It'd be kind of dull if Mufasa fought against Mufasa. Or Zeus and Hercules had to fight against another identical bulky meathead. And to be honest, those types of villains are actually more interesting than the heroes. Little Finger, Varys, The Joker, Loki, Hans Landa, Hannibal Lector, they're a thousand times better characters than their counterparts. But, that's just my two cents.

  34. I think it’s interesting to see how gay culture has reclaimed and redefined the image of these cartoon villains(Him(PPG), Ursula, Jafar,ect). But it doesn’t justify the continuation of homophobic representation.
    Anime also portrays similar homophobia. My least favorite being Pretty Prisoner in One Punch Man (you can watch it in Netflix). He is a gay man who is a top hero, great huh? Until you learn his feminity is played for laughs and in the manga it’s implied that he raped his “prison boyfriend”🤮. His feminine eyes lashes, clothing, and way of acting is contrasted for sake of comedy by his huge muscles.
    Also he chases around the other male heroes; predatory gay✅

  35. Man! Now i can't see Disney without someone doing these kind of assumptions. I never saw then as a "queer coding" not even the gender assumption you say. For me was only a way to draw them to look like they can be defeated because of the old "good destroys evil" loop Disney always uses. They not give those concepts of queer and stuff, they are meant for kids to understand that doing bad is wrong, and they're actions/wardrobe are meant to make the character memorable and so kids understand the lesson at the end of the movie.

  36. Rewatching this makes me think I need to re-evaluate one of my villains in my novel. He’s the second in command to a beautiful and powerful woman, on a diverse bad-guy team of men, women, and creatures, but I gave him a soft doughy physic and bee-stung lips originally because he’s a poisoner who has fallen susceptible to his own concoctions (over time due to proximity and preparation). I also gave him bright colors because I was thinking of Poisonous Dart Frogs, but now I want to change him and create a really fun/ interesting villain minus the feminine markers. Christian Bale’s Patrick Bateman seems like a good jumping off point.

  37. Watching this reminded me of how Elsa might have a girlfriend in the next frozen movie. I don’t know if that’s actually happening, but I’ve seen people talking about it from multiple sources.

  38. "This video is not an invitation for you to find every single exception to the rule."

    I need to use this as a disclaimer on every single thing I write. Ever. EVER.

  39. Watching you reminded me how much I like girls 😉 But on a more serious note I've always been struck by the appearance of Scar in the Lion King. Not only is he effeminate but he's also dark. I think Disney went overboard with him to make sure audiences could clearly distinguish between these non-human characters. On the other hand Radcliffe in Pocahontas is not necessarily "gay coding." Dandies were a real thing in the period and not really viewed negatively (although it could be used as a slur). It's more to show that he's a greedy rich guy.

  40. I've always identified with (most) of the villains, and this is why. I didn't understand that as a kid, but as an adult it's like "wow, holy shit."

  41. This video is very valid, it’s just funny because amongst me and my friends the villains have always been our favorite characters. Especially Ursula and Scar. So all those traits were never associated with “evil” or “bad” to anyone I know, but rather to “cool” “more interesting” . This was a very interesting thing to be made aware of. Great video!

  42. I want to thank you for using captions! I am a doc student and I have a large number of international students in my class. It helps them tremendously when I can turn on captions. I love it when captions are available because it makes it so much more accessible for my students. So thank you!

  43. Sure, the fashion could imply the queer coding
    But I find that villains look SO MUCH MORE INTERESTING than the heroes!!
    Look at Aladdin, he looks so basic and normal. Jafar looks so much more interesting!!
    Zeus has such a boring look, yet Hades has a colors that catch the eye, fire for hair, and his attire matches his realm!!
    Sure, these designs might imply something terrible, but it’s why I fell in love with villains!!
    They look like they have a purpose, that they’re different, and look generally interesting!!
    They seem a lot more likable to the hero, to me at least.

  44. I am a gay man and I love that the feminine guy characters are villains or evil. I think it gives depth to the gay community. Spare us ur concerns. And dont speak for us.

  45. As a bisexual female, an avid supporter of the drag community, and a Disney freak. Divine (the drag queen that inspired Ursula) was known for her dirty, gross, raunchy drag style. The makeup was harsh and somewhat scary. Like she literally ate dog crap on the set of a movie, and was typically bitchy character. There was a reason Divine was used as inspiration. You can even see it in the was Ursula acts and talks. That's really not a good example.

  46. Stop cherry picking examples to fit your narrative.
    It’s no secret Disney uses specific color psychiatry and outlier physical attributes to make villains and antagonists stand out.

  47. it also has to do with how most stories are structured

    Generally things start of good, villain shows up and makes things bad, and the good characters return everything to approximate normal.

    Less stories feature good guys bettering a pre existing bad system
    ( even those that do generally have a camel back breaking inciting incident)

    Because of this the protagonists don’t really have much time to scheme/ be clever and so rely more strongly on force.their designs then reflect this more brute strength design.

    The villains on the other hand have all the time in the world to plan out their takeover, and as such can use their brain more then their muscles. Their slimy designs communicate this.

  48. For all the people arguing that this is more about the Disney villains being shown as elite, upper class, or privilaged… nope. Take a single LGBT history class I beg you, this is basically the history of LGBT people in media during the 20th century. It's not just a Disney problem either, this is a Hollywood problem. They’ve been queer coding villains since the introduction of The Code in the 1930’s. A lot of male villains in film history are given hyperstereotypical ‘queer’ traits to add to the societal perception of gay men as being immoral, weak, or unnatural, especially in comparison to good, clean cut, red blooded American heros. It began to fade out around the 1970’s as LGBT characters started to be portrayed more favourably, and then picked right back up again with the mass hysteria around the AIDS crisis. We’re only just now starting to see the dismantling of some of this underlying homophobia in film.

  49. Disney: "We'll make the villains seem queer to make these expressions/actions less desirable."

    Me (nonbinary transgender, queer): "Be gay. Do crimes!"

  50. I'm black african and I'm offended by the fact that a AFRICAN LION on the AFRICAN SAVANNA is portrayed by a WHITE man who talks about marrying his own son. At least the mediocre live action remake will fix this.
    1. This is just a joke
    2. I'm not judging if you marry your son, I'm just making fun of Jeremy Irons

  51. I completely disagree with this first your calming traits as being exclusively queer I don't see how being lean, graceful, well dressed, well spoken or standing up straight is feminine. I feel like I'm looking and listening to another riley denies clone are you two related

  52. Fun fact about lions, Scar should actually have been much larger than Mufasa. That darker fur color in an indicator of higher testosterone levels. Male lions with darker manes/fur colors tend to be more virile and bigger, although their dark color means their temperature is harder to regulate so they lose sperm efficacy pretty quickly. But, dark is also usually bad as far as Disney is concerned so…..

  53. Thhis is not convincing.

    You point out Gaston, Hans, Clayton. Then you claim that that's somehow a minority, only to mention 4 or 5 counterexamples?

    Zeus is portrayed as a numbskull. Hercules' story is about him being strong. Go blame the Greeks. Scar is far from a convincing example either – they are LIONS. Of course the king has to be portrayed as a the strapping strong one. Because that's how alpha males work.
    Jafar? Not as if Aladdin is so muscular and manly.

  54. Disney did help me realize my sexuality w Mulan I'm bi btw 🙂 she was both masc and femme and Shang loved both sides of her

  55. Beast Of Edelwood

    Now that you mentioned Ratigan, I realized how he's one of the only two Disney villains I can think of who os much bigger and more muscular than the hero, the other being Rourke. Though he does have the implied makeup and feminine mannerisms, they're not really exclusive to him, as Basil isn't the traditional image of masculinity either.

  56. the pink joke is because almost everything is pink in candyland ,you can't tell me someone that has an almost entirely one colour house that isn't made fun of at the slightest.

  57. My favorite shorts I ever had my dad bought me at Disneyworld: they were all female Disney villains. Diva worship at 9 years old.

  58. i accidentally sent you a picture of my clock

    The only thing i disagree with is king candy, i forgot a lot about the movie, but wasn't sugar rush (the game king candy is in) supposed to be girly to some extent? Like i dont think its weird he'd look feminine considering it makes some sense.

  59. Loki Dah Trickster

    Why do u expect everyone to support stuff, but then judge people in the same manner u accuse of then of judging? 😐

  60. I wonder if effeminate male villians became prominent in "fin-de-siecle" Western literature in which "flashy" and scheming aristocrats were considered evil.

  61. Can you believe I ended up on this video cause I said that casting a real drag queen as Ursla could be a bit controversial. So,I decided to do some research to see if these campy "gay" villains were an issue in the LGBT+ community a community I am not a part of and the response is a bit mixed. Just in case I get into another weird argument I'm not against a famous drag queen yo be cast. It just to me feels more like casting an Indian to be a Apu in a live action Simpsons movie. feels like you might step on a few egg shells

  62. This entire video is you projecting your own homophobia onto everybody else. You see an aristocrat flaunting his massive wealth in flashy colours for the time period, and think “look at this fag!” And Scar is literally banished to a boneyard where food is scarce so he looks like he’s starving (forget the exact word you used) because… he literally was. Did you watch the movie? It’s not “queer” to live in what amounts to the animal kingdom’s impoverished sector and lack resources like food.

    That’s a you problem. Stop projecting. All these problems you talk about stem from you associating them with gay people yourself. Not others. You. You’re the one perpetuating these stereotypes. I bet you see a rapping gorilla and think it’s a black person too. Forget the EU accent when they talk. But the movie is racist, not you. Sure girl. Awful channel.

  63. Hades = a literal god
    Scar= userps his brothers thrown with a plan based off hemlet
    Dude from pokahontis = muscular, can rally troops
    Your also omitting ppl like the huns from mulan, and other disney villains of thier manly ilk. The holes in this thesis start to appear when looked at closer at each villain ant thier unique trait.

  64. Add Xerxes from 300. This all disgusts me. I've always seen this all even as a child, but was never able to articulate it until I was older.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *